discuss: Thread: August summary

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On Sun, 9 Oct 2005 ####@####.#### wrote:

> > Hello,
> >
> > there where no entry at all in my "tldp wiki" since
> > september 14. and very few before.
> >
> > I don't mind to monitor (against vandalism) an unused wiki
> > and think the wiki for tldp is not a so good idea if nobody
> > cares (except the few already known)
> >
> > so, for then end of the present month I will disable the
> > wiki and replace it by a small explanation page.
>
> The efforts are appreciated.
>
> Personally, for TLDP, given the various copyright, etc. issues,
> a comment-driven feedback system (a la php.net, which I think
> is excellent) might prove to be a better implementation (just
> my opinion, of course).

We should implement it on our own site, and link to it from various pages,
that should make it easier for people to reach us.  And it will also
attract readers who are not subscribed to this list.

Also, we need to think of some feedback notice so that people who read our
docs through a mirror can also be directed to the main comment site.

Tille.

- --
Machtelt Garrels                ####@####.####
Review Coordinator    	 	http://www.tldp.org/authors/

My Penguin, my freedom.         http://tille.xalasys.com

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On Sunday 09 October 2005 01:57 am, David Lawyer wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 03, 2005 at 03:35:00PM -0400, Randy Kramer wrote:
> > So, am I totally off base?
>
> No.  It depends on how it's done.  The new doc can't just copy or
> paraphrase parts of the old one.  It needs to be a new doc in it's own
> right and should incorporate a lot of new information.  You can look
> at the old one for facts while writing the new one, but you should be
> checking for facts elsewhere as well.

David,

Thanks for the response!

So, it appears to be feasible to create a new HOWTO by this means (with the 
caveats you mention).

I'm rather busy doing some other things for a while (which is a good thing ;-)  
I took another brief look at Tille's list of orphaned documents, if someone 
sees one that is of interest, we could try putting it on a wiki (either jdd's 
or WikiLearn) and see whether a rewrite goes anywhere.

regards,
Randy Kramer

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On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Randy Kramer wrote:

> I'm rather busy doing some other things for a while (which is a good thing ;-)
> I took another brief look at Tille's list of orphaned documents, if someone
> sees one that is of interest, we could try putting it on a wiki (either jdd's
> or WikiLearn) and see whether a rewrite goes anywhere.

I'd like to see that, but again, I think we will have better results if
the wiki is directly connected to the LDP web site.

For everybody's reference, here is the latest version of the unmaintained
documents list (plenty to choose from):

3D Graphics Modelling and Rendering ####@####.####
Linux Accessibility ####@####.####
How to Develop Accessible Linux ####@####.####
Linux ADSM ####@####.####
Linux Advanced Routing & Traffic Control ####@####.#### name or service not known,kleptog: name or service not known
Linux Advocacy ####@####.####
GNU/Linux AI & Alife ####@####.####
Brief Introduction to Alpha Systems and ####@####.#### or service not known
####@####.#### or service not known
Apache Overview ####@####.####
Linux Apache SSL PHP/FI frontpage ####@####.####
Apache based WebDAV Server with LDAP and ####@####.####
ATM on Linux ####@####.####
Authentication Gateway ####@####.####
Automount ####@####.####
Linux Backspace/Delete ####@####.####
Bangla PDF ####@####.####
BASH Programming - Introduction ####@####.#### such address
Battery Powered Linux ####@####.#### name or service not known
####@####.####
Boot + Root + Raid + Lilo : Software Raid ####@####.####
The Linux Bootdisk ####@####.#### rcpt host
The Linux ####@####.####
Bridging ####@####.####
Linux Bridge+Firewall ####@####.#### over quota
Linux ####@####.#### unknown user
Bzip2 ####@####.####
call-back mini ####@####.####
####@####.####
CD-Writing ####@####.####
Linux Chinese HOWTO English ####@####.#### or service not known, cwhuang: Quota exceeded
Chroot-BIND ####@####.####
Chroot-BIND8 ####@####.####
The Linux Cipe+Masquerading ####@####.#### or service not known
The Clock ####@####.####
Linux Cluster ####@####.####
Coffee ####@####.####
Commercial Port Advocacy ####@####.####
HOWTO Use a Compaq Remote ####@####.####
Compressed TCP/IP-Sessions using SSH-like ####@####.####
Conexant/Rockwell modem ####@####.####
Configuration ####@####.####
Cryptoloop ####@####.####
Cyrus IMAP ####@####.#### quota
Diald ####@####.####
Root over nfs clients & server ####@####.#### over quota
Root over NFS - Another ####@####.####
Divert Sockets ####@####.####
DocBook Install mini-HOWTO:: ####@####.#### or domain name not found
DocBook XML/SGML Processing Using ####@####.####
The dosemu ####@####.####
Linux DVD HOWTO::
Emacs Beginner's ####@####.####
Installing Emacspeak ####@####.#### or service not known
####@####.####
Linux ####@####.####
Event HOWTO:: ####@####.####
Linux Ext2fs Undeletion ####@####.####
Linux simple fax printer server ####@####.#### or domain name not found
Filesystems ####@####.#### create "/var/spool/mail/mhi"
Firewall and Proxy Server ####@####.####
USB Flash Memory ####@####.#### time not reached
Framebuffer ####@####.#### address
Le ####@####.####
- From Power Up To Bash ####@####.####
####@####.#### or service not known
FTP ####@####.####
Game Server ####@####.####
German ####@####.####
GRASS ####@####.#### recepient
Glibc 2 ####@####.####
Handspring-Visor with Linux ####@####.####
The Hebrew ####@####.####
Home Electrical Device Control ####@####.#### our customer
The Indic Fonts ####@####.#### back to myself
Linux Information ####@####.#### disabled
Ingres II ####@####.#### or service not known
How to setup international keyboard in X Window with Xmodmap and ####@####.####
The Linux Intranet Server ####@####.#### user
I/O Performance ####@####.####
Linux I/O port programming ####@####.####
Setting up IP Aliasing on A Linux Machine ####@####.####
Linux ####@####.####
Linux ####@####.####
####@####.####
Pocket ISP based on RedHat Linux ####@####.####
Jabber Server Farming ####@####.####
Java CGI ####@####.#### timed out
Linux on the Sun JavaStation  NC ####@####.####
The Elite's K7s5a mainboard ####@####.#### mail loops back to myself
Kerberos Infrastructure ####@####.####
####@####.####
Linux kerneld ####@####.#### rcpt host
Kiosk ####@####.####
The LBX ####@####.#### or servcie not known
LDAP Implementation ####@####.#### address rejected: Access denied, lobiondo: can't create user output file
Lex and YACC ####@####.####
####@####.####
Linux Crash ####@####.####
####@####.#### found
The Linux+FreeBSD ####@####.#### quota
Modem Sharing ####@####.####
NT OS Loader + Linux ####@####.#### quota
Linux+Solaris ####@####.####
Linux + Windows ####@####.#### failed,jkatz is not a valid mailbox
Linux + Windows 95 ####@####.#### timed out
Linuxdoc ####@####.#### or service not known
LinuxGL (GLX) QuakeWorld Client compile ####@####.#### or service not known
The Loadlin+Win95/98/ME ####@####.#### back to myself
Lotus Domino R5 for Linux ####@####.####
The MacTerminal ####@####.####
The Linux Electronic Mail Administrator ####@####.####
Linux Mail-Queue ####@####.#### name or service not known
Linux ####@####.####
Alpha Miniloader ####@####.####
Encrypted Tunnels using SSH and MindTerm ####@####.#### or service not known
Linux Kernel Modules Installation ####@####.####
Mozilla Optimization ####@####.####
MP3 Player Box ####@####.####
Connecting to MS SQL 6.x+ via Openlink/PHP/ODBC ####@####.#### back to myself
Multiboot with GRUB ####@####.#### timed out
Win95 + WinNT + Linux multiboot using LILO ####@####.#### or service not knwon
Multicast over TCP/IP ####@####.####
Development for Multiple Linux Distributions ####@####.####
Linux NCD ####@####.#### ####@####.#### does not like recipient.
NCD X terminal mini ####@####.####
Linux NETMEETING ####@####.#### connection timed out
HOW-TO for inHouse ####@####.#### cancelled
Network Boot and Exotic Root ####@####.####
The Linux Networking Overview ####@####.####
Linux ####@####.#### name or service not known
NetWare Loadable Module Programming ####@####.####
Nvidia OpenGL Configuration ####@####.####
Linux off-line mailing method (offline mailaddr with 1 ####@####.#### or service not known
Oracle Database ####@####.#### or service not known
Oracle 8i on Linux RH7.X Installation ####@####.#### user
Oracle 9i under RedHat Linux 8.x and 9.x - Simple Installation ####@####.####
MS Outlook to Unix Mailbox Conversion mini ####@####.####
The Linux Alphanumeric Pager Gateway ####@####.#### or service not known
Palm OS Desktop ####@####.####
Linux Parallel Processing ####@####.####
PATH ####@####.####
Linux PCMCIA ####@####.####
PCTel HSP MicroModem Configuration ####@####.#### mail or servcie not known, unmadindu: account expired
PHHTTPD HTTP Accelerator ####@####.####
Pine-Exchange ####@####.####
PLIP Install ####@####.####
Polish ####@####.####
PortSlave How-To using the Linux ####@####.#### refused
Linux ####@####.#### back to myself
Linux PPP ####@####.####
VPN PPP-SSH ####@####.####
GNU/Linux pre-installation ####@####.#### timed out
GNU/Linux Post-Installation ####@####.#### timed out
The Printing ####@####.####
The Linux Printing Usage ####@####.#### rcpt host, relay not permitted
Enabling Process Accounting on Linux ####@####.####
Programming Languages ####@####.####
Program Library HOWTO ####@####.####
ProxyARP Subnetting ####@####.####
Linux and Psion ####@####.####
Linux web browser ####@####.####
Querying libiptc ####@####.####
mini-HOWTO install qmail with ####@####.#### or service not known
Qmail VMailMgr and Courier-Imap ####@####.####
Linux Quake ####@####.#### timed out
Quota ####@####.####
Linux Remote-Boot ####@####.####
Remote Bridging with IP Tunnels ####@####.####
Remote Serial Console ####@####.####
Remote X Apps ####@####.####
Root RAID HOWTO ####@####.####
RPM ####@####.####
RTLinux ####@####.####
Saving Space ####@####.#### route to host
Scripting Graphical Commands with Tcl/Tk ####@####.####
The Linux 2.4 SCSI subsystem ####@####.####
The Linux SCSI Generic (sg) ####@####.####
Secure CVS Pserver ####@####.####
Secure POP via SSH ####@####.####
Secure Programming for Linux and Unix HOWTO ####@####.####
sendmail address rewriting ####@####.####
Sendmail + UUCP ####@####.####
Sentry Firewall CD ####@####.####
Serbian ####@####.#### name or service not known
Serial Laplink ####@####.####
Serial Programming ####@####.####
Linux Shadow Password ####@####.#### rejected
Slovak-HOWTO:: ####@####.####
Slovenian ####@####.####
Small Memory ####@####.#### create user output file
Smart Card ####@####.#### timeout exceeded
SMB ####@####.#### or service not known
Linux SMP ####@####.####
Free Software Project Management ####@####.####
The Software-RAID ####@####.####
Software-RAID ####@####.#### create user output file
Sound Blaster AWE 32/64 ####@####.####
The Linux Sound Playing ####@####.####
Speech Recognition ####@####.####
SRM Firmware ####@####.#### create user output file
Linux Swap Space ####@####.####
Sybase Adaptive Server Anywhere for Linux ####@####.####
Sybase-PHP-Apache ####@####.####
Tamil Linux ####@####.#### not found
Tango 2000 ####@####.#### or service not known
The teTeX HOWTO: The Linux-teTeX Local Guide:: ####@####.####
The Linux Thai ####@####.####
The Linux Tips ####@####.#### timed out
TkRat ####@####.#### disabled
Token-Ring ####@####.####
Transparent Proxy with Linux and Squid ####@####.#### back to myself
TrueType Fonts in Debian ####@####.####
TrueType Fonts with XFree86 4.x ####@####.####
####@####.####
UMSDOS ####@####.####
The Unicode ####@####.#### address
Upgrading Your linux Distribution ####@####.####
User Authentication ####@####.####
The Linux UUCP ####@####.####
Linux VAR ####@####.####
VB6 To Tcl ####@####.####
####@####.####
Virtual Services ####@####.#### or servcie not known
Virtual Web ####@####.####
VMailMgr ####@####.#### misconfiguration
VoIP ####@####.####
Wacom Tablet ####@####.####
Wacom Graphire USB ####@####.####
Web Browsing Behind ISA Server ####@####.#### or service not known
LDP WikiText Editing ####@####.#### rcpt host
The Winmodems-and-Linux ####@####.####
Wireless ####@####.####
Link-sys WPC11 ####@####.####
A mSQL and perl Web Server Mini ####@####.####
XDM and X Terminal ####@####.####
XFree Local Multi-User ####@####.#### timed out
ATI R200 + XFree86 4.x ####@####.#### or service not known
Linux Touch Screen ####@####.####
Linux XFree-to-Xinside ####@####.#### user
Using Xinerama to MultiHead XFree86 V. ####@####.####
Connecting X Terminals to Linux ####@####.####
How to change the title of an ####@####.#### refused
X Window System Architecture Overview ####@####.####
Zip Drive Mini-HOWTO:: ####@####.#### or service not known
KDE GUI Login Configuration ####@####.####


Tille.

- --
Machtelt Garrels                ####@####.####
Review Coordinator    	 	http://www.tldp.org/authors/

My Penguin, my freedom.         http://tille.xalasys.com


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On Wednesday 12 October 2005 04:48 am, Machtelt Garrels wrote:
> On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Randy Kramer wrote:
> > I'm rather busy doing some other things for a while (which is a good
> > thing ;-) I took another brief look at Tille's list of orphaned
> > documents, if someone sees one that is of interest, we could try putting
> > it on a wiki (either jdd's or WikiLearn) and see whether a rewrite goes
> > anywhere.
>
> I'd like to see that, but again, I think we will have better results if
> the wiki is directly connected to the LDP web site.

I agree, but how do we make that happen?

Randy Kramer

> On Wednesday 12 October 2005 04:48 am, Machtelt Garrels wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Randy Kramer wrote:
>>....
>> I'd like to see that, but again, I think we will have better results if
>> the wiki is directly connected to the LDP web site.
>
> I agree, but how do we make that happen?

Again, we can put a wiki directly on ibilio (our host). Based on
what I've seen/read over the last few months, I'm no longer convinced
a wiki is the appropriate solution for LDP (I guess that's why
I stopped persuing installing one on our host).

Greg

Hi

>Again, we can put a wiki directly on ibilio (our host). Based on
>what I've seen/read over the last few months, I'm no longer convinced
>a wiki is the appropriate solution for LDP (I guess that's why
>I stopped persuing installing one on our host).
>
>Greg
>  
>
Can you continue your prodding the host and get the wiki installed. 
Atleast it would be provide a opportunity for the wiki favoring people 
to play with it and try to convince LDP that its a potentially good way. 
This discussion is otherwise going in circles.

regards
Rahul

Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> Hi
> 
>> Again, we can put a wiki directly on ibilio (our host). Based on
>> what I've seen/read over the last few months, I'm no longer convinced
>> a wiki is the appropriate solution for LDP (I guess that's why
>> I stopped persuing installing one on our host).
>>
>> Greg
>>  
>>
> Can you continue your prodding the host and get the wiki installed. 
> Atleast it would be provide a opportunity for the wiki favoring people 
> to play with it and try to convince LDP that its a potentially good way. 
> This discussion is otherwise going in circles.

very few people of this list seemed to be interested by the 
wiki I proposed. A wiki needs some watching, this is worth 
if it's used, but not if nobody cares.

it's not that important. we can probably live without one :-)

jdd


-- 
pour m'écrire, aller sur:
http://www.dodin.net
http://valerie.dodin.net
http://arvamip.free.fr

H

>> Can you continue your prodding the host and get the wiki installed. 
>> Atleast it would be provide a opportunity for the wiki favoring 
>> people to play with it and try to convince LDP that its a potentially 
>> good way. This discussion is otherwise going in circles.
>
>
> very few people of this list seemed to be interested by the wiki I 
> proposed. A wiki needs some watching, this is worth if it's used, but 
> not if nobody cares.
>
> it's not that important. we can probably live without one :-)
>
> jdd
>
Thats a catch 22 situation since we dont supply the wiki nor invite 
others to participate in a active way. Installing it and experimenting 
with it for a while would help break out of it

regards
Rahul

On Wednesday 12 October 2005 08:54 pm, Rahul Sundaram wrote:
> Hi
>
> >Again, we can put a wiki directly on ibilio (our host). Based on
> >what I've seen/read over the last few months, I'm no longer convinced
> >a wiki is the appropriate solution for LDP (I guess that's why
> >I stopped persuing installing one on our host).
> >
> >Greg
>
> Can you continue your prodding the host and get the wiki installed.
> Atleast it would be provide a opportunity for the wiki favoring people
> to play with it and try to convince LDP that its a potentially good way.
> This discussion is otherwise going in circles.

I'd be hesitant about prodding the host (ibiblio(sp?)) to install a wiki 
until:
   * there is some agreement on which wiki
   * there is somebody willing to put the document on the wiki
   * there is a document chosen for the purpose

There is no sense "prodding" anyone if there is not some certitude about 
subsequent followup.

Also, I'm not sure, would ibiblio actually install the wiki or simply give us 
(someone) the necessary permissions and so forth to install it ourselves.

Although I don't know when I'd have the knowledge or time to do it, my 
preference would be TWiki.  I know that:
   * a new release of TWiki is imminent (sp?)
   * TWiki has a fair number of dependencies--I don't know all of them, but 
they include perl (and, ideally mod-perl for speed, but there is a potential 
complication, at least in older versions of TWiki only one could exist on a 
single virtual host (because TWiki used global variables for too many (and 
the wrong) things--I believe that has been fixed, or will be with the 
imminent release).  Also, TWiki needs a web server (most commonly, ime, 
Apache (and, last time I knew, there were some problems / concerns about 
Apache2).  TWiki also needs some CPAN modules.
   * TWiki is easier to install with root access.  It can (almost) be done 
without root access, but I believe at least sudo is required for some parts 
of the job (or some parts will have to be written up as tasks to be done by 
the ibiblio administrator (iirc, setting permissions on certain files, etc.).  
This is another area that I believe will be improved with the next release.

Re imminent release, I think the plan was for October (2005 ;-), but I don't 
recall a date being specified.  Maybe early November is a reasonable 
expectation.

If jdd wants to install his preferred wiki (is that MediaWiki?), I can live 
with that, but may not be as active in adding the original content (as I am 
not proficient in MediaWiki).

regards,
Randy Kramer

Randy Kramer wrote:

> I'd be hesitant about prodding the host (ibiblio(sp?)) to install a wiki 
> until:
>    * there is some agreement on which wiki
>    * there is somebody willing to put the document on the wiki
>    * there is a document chosen for the purpose
> 
> There is no sense "prodding" anyone if there is not some certitude about 
> subsequent followup.

+1

> 
> Also, I'm not sure, would ibiblio actually install the wiki or simply give us 
> (someone) the necessary permissions and so forth to install it ourselves.

probably give permissions

> 
> Although I don't know when I'd have the knowledge or time to do it, my 
> preference would be TWiki.

it's up to you. I can use tkwiki, but don't want to manage 
it, I don't want to learn too many wikis.

   I know that:
>    * a new release of TWiki is imminent (sp?)
>    * TWiki has a fair number of dependencies

???

meiawiki installs in nearly any config - i I could do on my 
own server it can be done anywhere :-)

no root account needed, only mysql access

mediawiki is on 1.5 stable now since some days

> If jdd wants to install his preferred wiki (is that MediaWiki?), I can live 
> with that, but may not be as active in adding the original content (as I am 
> not proficient in MediaWiki).

to be clear, I won't be active to add any content out of my 
own HOWTO (except basis, that is to say home page, basic 
management).

to be of any interest, a wiki must be a self running app .

it only needs a dayly survey of the "recent changes" page. 
If active, any user will warn in case of vandalism.

a dayly backup is also usefull.

jdd


-- 
pour m'écrire, aller sur:
http://www.dodin.net
http://valerie.dodin.net
http://arvamip.free.fr